Comments on: SEO goes back Underground in 2009 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html I think there's an opinion on that subject lying around here somewhere.... Wed, 22 May 2013 19:24:39 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.7 by: quqabita http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129283 Fri, 18 Sep 2009 14:24:18 +0000 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129283 Early Adopters or early birds in any business model tend to get swamped by laggards-the Johnny-come-latelies and I promise you the enthusiasm and naivety of the latter irks the former big time.There are 2 options as you have rightly pointed out-leave the fouled joint by creating a new trend. This is a natural process. You can't stop it. it is the order of the d ay in all facets of life. Early Adopters or early birds in any business model tend to get swamped by laggards-the Johnny-come-latelies and I promise you the enthusiasm and naivety of the latter irks the former big time.There are 2 options as you have rightly pointed out-leave the fouled joint by creating a new trend.

This is a natural process. You can’t stop it. it is the order of the d ay in all facets of life.

]]> by: Suthnautr http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129249 Wed, 09 Sep 2009 11:34:40 +0000 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129249 When I was a kid I did a lot of running, weight lifting, calisthenics, yoga and watched my diet and took my vitamins. Over the years I broke the 4 minute mile, came in first out of 5,000 men in the military in brigade competition, on the obstacle course, and almost broke the fort record in one of the competitions. The point I'm making is that just like becoming an athlete, it takes years of cumulative effort mastering the computer and the internet to become expert at SEO. The first few times I ranked a site on page one for competitive keywords when the SERPs showed 55,000,000 page results I had to figure out what it was that I had done right. It wasn't in the domain name, it wasn't in the number of back links, it was in the content - and I got my "Eurika!" first real SEO secret by analyzing what I did right. I do that same kind of analysis now on a regular basis to discover other SEO's hidden secrets. While it's certainly true that we can't disclose what our competitive edges are to the entire public (and why should we - we're ultimately competitors and in it not just for love, but also to make livings) the fact is that the masses of self SEOs and SEO wannabe's just plain aren't qualified. They don't have the years of cumulative experience, they lack the natural talent, intellectually they suck at any kind of science, and in general they're a bunch of screw ups. The real danger to SEOs is the con-artists that take clients money and fail to deliver, turning off a completely good revenue source to ever wanting to pay for SEO again. There are billions of pages and sites that need optimization, so running headlong into each other competing in the same niche at the same time for page one ranking is relatively small - and even if you rank one and I rank two on page one, we'll all still be happy. If the good ones all go underground then the self proclaiming expert quacks will take over totally discrediting SEO and driving the price way down no matter what kind of real expertise you have. I'm not so sure going underground is the way to go. At least keeping valid "white hat" SEO sites up to date and exposing what doesn't work will keep our domains ranking and possibly save some clients from being robbed. That's what SEO is all about - saving clients from being robbed and at the same time making everybody more money. When I was a kid I did a lot of running, weight lifting, calisthenics, yoga and watched my diet and took my vitamins. Over the years I broke the 4 minute mile, came in first out of 5,000 men in the military in brigade competition, on the obstacle course, and almost broke the fort record in one of the competitions. The point I’m making is that just like becoming an athlete, it takes years of cumulative effort mastering the computer and the internet to become expert at SEO.

The first few times I ranked a site on page one for competitive keywords when the SERPs showed 55,000,000 page results I had to figure out what it was that I had done right. It wasn’t in the domain name, it wasn’t in the number of back links, it was in the content - and I got my “Eurika!” first real SEO secret by analyzing what I did right. I do that same kind of analysis now on a regular basis to discover other SEO’s hidden secrets.

While it’s certainly true that we can’t disclose what our competitive edges are to the entire public (and why should we - we’re ultimately competitors and in it not just for love, but also to make livings) the fact is that the masses of self SEOs and SEO wannabe’s just plain aren’t qualified. They don’t have the years of cumulative experience, they lack the natural talent, intellectually they suck at any kind of science, and in general they’re a bunch of screw ups. The real danger to SEOs is the con-artists that take clients money and fail to deliver, turning off a completely good revenue source to ever wanting to pay for SEO again. There are billions of pages and sites that need optimization, so running headlong into each other competing in the same niche at the same time for page one ranking is relatively small - and even if you rank one and I rank two on page one, we’ll all still be happy. If the good ones all go underground then the self proclaiming expert quacks will take over totally discrediting SEO and driving the price way down no matter what kind of real expertise you have. I’m not so sure going underground is the way to go. At least keeping valid “white hat” SEO sites up to date and exposing what doesn’t work will keep our domains ranking and possibly save some clients from being robbed. That’s what SEO is all about - saving clients from being robbed and at the same time making everybody more money.

]]> by: yourseosucks http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129243 Tue, 08 Sep 2009 15:59:27 +0000 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129243 Yes. Yes. Agreed. Who are the new guys in the room? And what are they doing? I hope they don't ever tell. I know I won't. Going back underground makes it fun again. >) Yes. Yes. Agreed. Who are the new guys in the room? And what are they doing? I hope they don’t ever tell. I know I won’t. Going back underground makes it fun again. >)

]]> by: Dustin Woodard http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129234 Mon, 07 Sep 2009 13:31:13 +0000 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129234 It is interesting watching the ever-changing migration of SEO veterans. Many successful SEOs have long been underground, but I agree that 2009 has shown more underground behavior then years past, especially among SEOs who were very public just a couple years ago. It is interesting watching the ever-changing migration of SEO veterans. Many successful SEOs have long been underground, but I agree that 2009 has shown more underground behavior then years past, especially among SEOs who were very public just a couple years ago.

]]> by: Jim Hay http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129216 Thu, 03 Sep 2009 10:30:01 +0000 http://www.johnon.com/694/seo-kickbacks.html#comment-129216 John, Your post was very interesting reading. I agree with you on several points. Most importantly that with the increase in public interest and awareness of SEO. I am a web designer that got into the industry via the need to market a business of mine that was marketed nationally. I as many business owners was ripped off in the past and work very hard at delivering goods when contracted to do so. My personal outlook in SEO is using the time tested techniques of good SEO practices. Good on page practices, good code, and developing quality inbound links. It works for me. Understanding good SEO practices and applying them in different ways has always delivered good results. John, Your post was very interesting reading. I agree with you on several points. Most importantly that with the increase in public interest and awareness of SEO. I am a web designer that got into the industry via the need to market a business of mine that was marketed nationally. I as many business owners was ripped off in the past and work very hard at delivering goods when contracted to do so.
My personal outlook in SEO is using the time tested techniques of good SEO practices. Good on page practices, good code, and developing quality inbound links. It works for me. Understanding good SEO practices and applying them in different ways has always delivered good results.

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